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Thema: 10 pfg letter to Amerika ca.1910 ?
Germanica Am: 10.10.2020 22:05:45 Gelesen: 135# 1 @  
Ich bin auf diesen Brief mit einer 10 Pfg Germania gestoßen. 1910 (die 0 ist ungewiss, vielleicht ist es 1912, es sieht wie ein Friedensdruck aus). Der Adressat-beschreiben ist mir nicht so klar, doch es mit ein "Amerika" zu enden und vielleicht ein notiz von "Dampfer" hatte. Zu diesem Zeitpunkt betrug die porto für ein Brief nach Amerika 20 Pfg. Es sollt nicht ein drucksache werden, wie es nicht often ist.

Ein rote "kontor" stempel oder so vorderseitig. Keine andere marken rückseitig.

Was ist los? Jede Hilfe geschätzt. :-)

doktorstamp Am: 12.10.2020 22:17:42 Gelesen: 105# 2 @  
Hi there,

I have replied in English, and hope you are conversant with the language.

The address side reads as follows;

An Frau Margaret Anderson
230 Wald Straße (Quite why the sender wrote this I have no idea, I can find no reference to a Wood Street in Hillburn, it is quite a small place with just under 1,000 inhabitants today, at the time the letter was sent, the inhabitants numbered around 950).
Hillburn, New York

"Mit Deutschen Dampfer" Amerika

You are correct in saying 20 Pfg was the correct overseas rate for a letter up to 20g.

1910 is most likely the correct date. There appears to have been no attempt to charge postage due, (absence of markings, either in script, or otherwise).

It is a peacetime printing

Had the letter been posted on board, then the 10 Pfg paid would be correct, however, again, there is nothing to confirm this.

I finish with a small note; when you joined it would have been possible to state your preferred language or mother tongue, many here speak languages other than German. knowing this would facilitate an answer in a mutually understood language.

Are the contents still with the envelope?


Germanica Am: 13.10.2020 10:57:17 Gelesen: 96# 3 @  
Thanks for replying

It is fine with me to reply in english. I wrote the post in english originally, but was guided by a moderator to change it to german ?? I am a bit confused about the rules here !

I agree with your considerations. Hillburn is a small town just north of New York right ? So unless it was never carried to its destination overseas, or was carried by someone personally aboard a vessel who then carried it from perhaps New York harbour to Hillburn, it would have had some kind of American marking somewhere on it. Receiving marks were still common at this point right ?

The red 5 digit marking is my only reference for something that might be either a private registry mark (though it seems unlikely for a "private" receiver). Or it was a marking from a ship, that carried the letter outside the postal service for some "personal" reason.

it seems the explanation fades into the unknown :-)

There are no contents but the envelope has traces at the top of being opened with a letter-opener.

No other postal markings anywhere than what you see on the scan. The envelope is a "lady"-size and was closed (not printed matter).

A "Ib Läschke-L BPP" prüfer marking is present on the back (it is faint and I just discovered it a few minutes ago, while scouting for other "markings" :-)) . A 10 pfg Germania Mi.86Ib, would put the dating of the cover until after 20.07.1911 (Michel spezial 2015 eku) and so probably dated 1912 ??
ligneN Am: 15.10.2020 01:46:08 Gelesen: 74# 4 @  
There was a special reduced rate in both directions USA <--> Germany by treaty effective Jan. 1, 1909: direct closed mail (not via France or UK) by german or US steamer, 2c/oz. or 10 pf./20grs. As of Feb. 5, 1915 normal UPU rates applied, since there was no longer a direct steamer service to Germany

Start published in
PB (postal bulletin) 8781 Dec. 15, 1908.

This is gleaned from Wawrukiewicz/Beecher*, p. 25:
"Direct mail from continental US by German steamers, per oz."
Included Hawaii from Aug. 1, 1909.

This was for letters only. Prints or cards are not mentioned.

NB there was a similiar regulation between the US and UK, 1908.10.1 to 1931.8.31.

* A.S. Wawrukiewicz, H.W. Beecher: U.S. International Postal Rates, 1872-1996. Portland, 1996.
Germanica Am: 15.10.2020 08:38:08 Gelesen: 69# 5 @  
Thank you very much :-) ... this is a great insight.

I had a hunch that it it could be some treaty rate with US, but had no reference to it nowhere. The Jan1, 1909 is clear

The feb 15, 1915 I cannot locate anything, is that because this is the effective date and not the bulletin date ? Thus I will need to go backwards a bulletin at a time to find a possible reference :-)

thanks Rene
ligneN Am: 15.10.2020 19:15:58 Gelesen: 56# 6 @  
@ rekj1966 [#5]

15 my typo, it was Feb. 5, W/B p. 25

Service suspended (PB 10656, Feb. 5, 1915)

See also W/B p. 5 col. 1.

W/B is a must (and I dont even collect US postal history).

Current edition:
2011, 3rd edition, 1872 - 2011, revised and expanded, 463 pages, cloth , $60.00
Germanica Am: 16.10.2020 21:34:49 Gelesen: 42# 7 @  
Oh no, you were right I misread your post.
Thanks for giving me the insights. Appreciated :-)
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